I'm still on vacation with precious few minutes of this Internet in a public space, so I must be brief.
I've been reading and I read this from Donne:
"When love with one another so
Interanimates two souls;
That abler soul which thence doth flow,
Defects of loneliness controls"
And, I read this discussion of that:
"Ecstasy is a mystical state in which the soul escapes the body to seek union with the divine."
And then,
"...the entities which flow from (Donne's) soul and his lover's unite to create a third entity, a perfect whole or divinity."
D/s comes in various packages. People often don't know what they mean when they write, but if one has experienced that "perfect whole", one does one's best to describe it. Alas, it is often untranslatable.
Yet, the first thing I will do when I get home will be to get down my very old edition of Donne's poems. He was definitely onto something.
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Donne is not on my list of poets to read, but self-transcendence is definitely how I understand love. I don't like Proust's narcissistic conception at all (although I like Proust a lot).
ReplyDeleteSo was Donne a D or an s?
I love Donne, Vesta (no man is an island - oddly just quoted that myself) - and delighted you're having a wonderful vacation; hope you're getting lots of wonderful weather and time with loved ones!
ReplyDeleteI know my poor words are rarely up to conveying what I feel.
ReplyDeleteBut isn't it lovely to find someone else who can capture the feeling?
Hope you're having fun, twirly girl!
Jz
73: I am ashamed to say that my university copy of Donne is evidence that at the time I was not paying much attention to his poetry. There is barely a note to be found in the margins. However, I did a little reading of his life this morning and it seems that he had a long marriage and many children that he had to support. Before that, he explored relationships with women enthusiastically it seems, spending whatever money he had on them. How dominant he was, I don't know, but it seems to me he was trying to put into words his notion of the man and woman in perfect union and harmony creating something sacred in that union.
ReplyDeleteI thought this more informed material might help:
"Donne is considered a master of the metaphysical conceit, an extended metaphor that combines two vastly different ideas into a single idea, often using imagery. An example of this is his equation of lovers with saints in "The Canonization." Unlike the conceits found in other Elizabethan poetry, most notably Petrarchan conceits, which formed clichéd comparisons between more closely related objects (such as a rose and love), metaphysical conceits go to a greater depth in comparing two completely unlike objects, although sometimes in the mode of Shakespeare's radical paradoxes and imploded contraries."
selkie: I have tended to give poetry a wide berth, preferring the narrative, but I've been enjoying a little poetry lately and Donne seems so right for our mindset, doesn't he?!
ReplyDeleteWe did have a lovely time together, thank you, and most importantly, my younger sons had some quality time with their parents.
Jz: That is exactly what I was trying to say with only a few seconds to say it. We know what we feel but how do we convey that emotion to another in words? Donne managed to do that, I think, as best as anyone can. I write and write trying to express myself but he does so much better in just a few lines.
I checked: his Holy Sonnents are on my list.
ReplyDelete73: I'm so pleased. And, I shall read them, too, now that my edition is by my bed.
ReplyDelete